Tim Sweeney on Tencent accessing user data, Epic Store exclusives, older Epic games and more

In a series of tweets, Epic Games’ CEO Tim Sweeney commented on whether Tencent can have access to users’ data, future Epic Store exclusive games, when the store will open to indie developers, whether the company is planning to re-release some of its older titles and more.

As Sweeney noted, even though Tencent may have access to financial statements, it has no access to customer data.

Furthermore, Sweeney claimed that there wasn’t any Epic Games security breach (despite some reports that were surfaced earlier this year).

Sweeney also stated that Epic is focusing on bringing more exclusives to the store that implementing new features to it. While Sweeney claimed that the team is building lots of new features, it is going full speed ahead on games without wait. And, as we’ve said numerous times, this is something that frustrated a lot of gamers as the store currently lacks major features.

Regarding older Epic games, such as Unreal Tournament and Unreal, coming to the store, Sweeney said that the team is looking into it, though he could not confirm nor deny whether this will happen in the foreseeable future.

Last but not least, Sweeney said that the store will open to all small indie developers later in 2019.

191 thoughts on “Tim Sweeney on Tencent accessing user data, Epic Store exclusives, older Epic games and more”

  1. The fact that on the friggin Epic Store you can’t purchase the games of the friggin store owners is…Appalling? Complete nonsense? Retarded?

    What the hell…

    1. They just see it as low priority. I remember a story not long ago that they stopped selling their Unreal 3 IOS game trilogy some time ago. Dumb decision? maybe, but they are still swimming in money so what do i know.

        1. Sorry to be a pedant but Atari Inc were doing it with their 2600 console with Master Module, modem and GameLine service in the early 1980s. They weren’t the first either.

      1. half life 3 not being released was an insult to humanity, agreed. Valve f*ked up big. They had bigger fish to fry at the time. They realized that is better to be the General Contractor, than the subcontractor toiling at the manual labor. And in the end, we all had a lot to win from it. They got us thru a tough time for pc gaming. After a lot of grieving, I got to the point where I no longer cared about HL3. Never forgave Valve though, any game that I can buy from somewhere else, I do. But they’re still better than Epic store.

        1. See you finally gets it . This is the only way to converse with squirrel brain a.k.a Don Quixote. ?

          1. I just hope for him that at least he gets paid for going on game news websites and defend X or Y company. And I mean it seriously.

            It still does not excuse the fact that Epic does not want to sell THEIR OWN GAMES ON THEIR OWN STORE. Hell, just give the old DOS stuff for free and make it pay for them on GOG, maybe a Fortnite kid this way will be able to enjoy the Jazz Jackrabbit games since it would probably have never bought them.

    2. you cant buy anything in the epic store apart from timed exlusive aaa games and some indies

      their goal isnt to build a store but to force you to buy from their store if you want new games.

  2. I’m sure I’m not the only one to have their Epic account hacked last year. Yeah right no data breach.

      1. Fear, uncertainty, and doubt

        I wouldn’t call it FUD, I mean, there’s a lot of valid criticism towards Epic. That said, DSOG comments still a bunch of circlejerkers jerking themselves off on the Epic Hatetrain.

        1. Not really. The edgelords here don’t like Steam either but the circlejerk is justified.

          Epic has a very clear path towards being a legitimate competitor and Tim Sweeneys comments to every step along that path are “Maybe. We’ll see. We’ll stop doing this. JK we’re going to keep doing this.” “We’ll look into that.”

        2. I think Epic provides a great opportunity for Steam to try to do better towards consumers on certain blindspots (like the one Epic exposed: interesting exclusive games to look forward to), but fanboys gonna fanboy.

          1. (like the one Epic exposed: interesting exclusive games to look forward to)

            What kind of english is this exactly? Besides do you realize they basically bribed SHs with tons of money to convince them accept their proposals, right?

  3. Yes, I’m totally going to believe the man whos near half of his company is owned by a chinese government subsidiary and whos own gamestore datamines the steam friends lists of everyone who uses it without their consent. How about this, how about your program NOT do those things or asks me if i want to allow it?

      1. Another day, another meltdown from you. Your latest verbal diarrhea has so far extended to,

        “Steam Stockholm Syndrome”
        “steam troll”
        “retarded”
        “Stream drone” (sic)
        “Steam Trolls”

        …across at least fourteen (and counting) tantrum-filled comments. Pitiful.

        1. And he brought friends. We now have 4 of them on here. Mark my words, squirrel brain and his followers will Hijack the hell out of this place.

          1. Haha, Heyoooooo ???. Got ‘Emmm. But seriously though, good job on labeling his vocabulary progression. I too, notice that he says more than just, “Fud”. Whatever the hell that means. That dude has made a mockery of the English language.

          2. The outbursts of an emotionally incontinent, semi-literate, foul-mouthed, spam-posting fanboy haven’t won you over? No way!

          1. actually no, he won’t be able to know who’s who because he’s got half of the users on dsog blocked.

    1. It’s ok to be skeptical, but i don’t get the whole chicom spy bashing, when so many western/silicon valley companies do their own (and arguably much worse) spying and suck up to appease chimcoms, like the case with jewgle and kikebook.

      1. the own US gov spies on everyone and facebook and google know where most people are at all times, but people get mad about epic games knowing their steam friends 😐

        1. Yeah, the logic really isn’t there.
          Facebook tracks you across multiple devices at once while google literally knows your coordinates and sells that info to the highest bidder, but that’s fine.
          Bring up that Steam friends list (which other companies have surely mined already). That’s off limits…it’s silly.

          1. People who still thinks we live in a free society are delusional. There is probably more free speech in dictatorships( the fact that this affirmation is arguible says it all)

          2. I don’t think we live in a free society, you can’t be so tightly connected to everyone and at the same time remote from them. But I like that I can criticise my government and still be okay. And if I choose to live like a hermit, it’s hard to do it, but I can.

          3. You can’t actually criticize your government, and no, criticizing Trump’s policies or Obama’s policies isn’t “criticise the government”.

          4. You mean criticise the form of government? Even that is okay, as long as it is verbal only. But if you try to change the goverment, just like any other entity, it will fight for its survival. But why would you want to change it in the first place? What other form of government is better? It’s not rethorical, I would like to know 🙂

          1. strong words, so I take it China is good? Russia is good? huawei doing business with iran is good? But US gov is bad 🙁

          2. your opinion, and I won’t say it’s trash. But before you impart it, you should go live in China a few years, then in Russia , then in the US. Then I will listen to your experiences.

          3. I don’t think i’m fit to live in those countries, but maybe i could live in the US on the notion that your nation isn’t a nation, but just some tourist location, a commoditie to leech of, etc (the fact that i know a bit of english also helps)

          4. Lol, why are we even word dueling, I agree with you. The world is not ready for globalism, not yet at least, maybe in a few hundred years when eveyone is a shade of light brown. But like any disturbance in the water, the change comes in waves. You had the nationalism of the 1st and 2nd world war, then the global immigration movement and now the counteraction to that movement. We might not want it, (for fear of losing our identity, a pretty illogical and primal fear to fair) but don’t worry, it is coming. I am curious what’s gonna happen in a few hundred years, there are so many avenues humanity can take.

        2. Yeah, that’s a proven fact, but then the own USgov and it’s media apparatus divert and project the threat to an manufactured external “threat”(Russia, China, Huawei, etc)

          1. If we let people like you tell it then racism has never existed anywhere at anytime in history. I get the feeling that’s where you’re coming from with “not really”.

            Iv’e read some pretty awful things on this site’s message board, and it makes me wonder if the morons saying these things need a reminder that this is a video games site.

          2. Racism goes away when similar people with similar beliefs, race, appearance, etc live together, but since society forces us to integrate with different people, races, beliefs, etc. then racism is a elite manufactured problem (a form of control).

          3. I just find it hilarious that the progressive utopia’s of scandinavia that lefties like so much are homogeneous white countries with more economic liberty than usa and the moment they increased migration, well, denmark is spending billions in immigrants who dont work and they are now changing that and all those countries in scandinavia who took all those mgrants from the third world have ridiculously high raaaape statistics….its almost as if… diversity isnt our strength.

        1. The creator of the term “racism” was communist jew Leon “Brownstein” Trotsky. Needless to say, i don’t agree with his concepts.

      2. I would take capitalists over comunists spying on me every day of the year. What does google and facebook want from me when they spy? to make money. What do the chinese want? ultimately to make us all their ideological slaves. God forbid any of you live under communism. I pity the north korean and chinese people.

        It kills your spirit, it suffocates you not to be able to say what you want to say for fear of retribution.

        1. You are clueless, google, facebook and others are censoring dissidents and engaging in social engineering, historic revisionism, lobbying for censorship and much more. You are concerned about an external threat when the enemy at the gates operates with impunity.

          1. I don’t know man, what am i supposed to say when the CEO of these companies are jewish, should i just ignore them?

          2. jews have the highest iq, this is they are always in high places, its not a conspiracy theory. This is why blacks and arabs are not, they got the lowest iq.

          3. Does high IQ makes you more likely to censor opinions and lobby against native citizens?

          4. @fndvssantiago that awkward moment when you kinda agree with someone but realize you are actually diametral opposed to them. The truth is there are as many opinions as there are heads.

          5. Yeah bro, there is only one race: the human race. Also, racism is real. GET REAL!! Also their censorship is coordinated and goes just one way, just like their own racism.

          6. Bullshit, they protect jewish racial nationalism (zionism), black nationalism (which is kind of irrelevant for them, unless we are talking about Nation of Islam) but censors euro nationalism or any partisan view that criticizes their racial interests, war crimes, etc. It’s an interesting construct to frame racism as a lower caste issue (a simple distraction), but the tech tyrants and other fat cats are way ahead on this game.

          7. “What’s wrong with Zionism?”

            Apparently nothing, since it doesn’t get censored, but similar views applied to other races may not be so lucky.

          8. i dont get this idiocy, look at the latest elections in Israel, its a mess, they never had a part winning majority, the jews are not a monolith, they are in fact one giant freaking mess as far as ideology goes. They act as if there arent antifarts in israel or mayors who are arabs and bash the jews and prevent them from organizing but back up the islamists and help them organize.

            Its the same bs everywhere folks, jews are not behind it, they are split into different groups too, you got orthodox jews, secularist nationalists, far left open borders communists who hate themselves and their country, and of course objectivists.

            also if you want to see (((gloabalists))) i reccomend you look up a video called “(((Globalists))) discuss how to subvert Poland and destroy the Polish people” you can hear them saying they wont to take jews who visit a certain concentration camp in poland that starts with the letter A, and take them from there and send them hang out with hippies and communists and have orrrgies so they abandon israel and the “propaganda” that if they dont protect it they will end up the same way 6 million of them did in ww2.

            Its clear that the (((globalists))) hate israel and want to destroy it no different than any other country.

          9. Israel kind of make nationalists look bad, because they are so ruthless towards their neighbohood, i mean, the wall is nice, but apartheid policies, killings of unarmed civilians, babies women etc is too extreme for me. Should i just ignore the fact that the majority of political bribing (also called “donors”) in US is jewish, the push for censure is backed by jewish CEO and jewish NGO’s etc. just because of some random based schmuck jew?

          10. Do you really thing the palestianians dont ask for it? They constantly stab the jews and fire rockets, the kids throw rocks on them, the wall and the apartheid are needed in order to survive and this bs that they are killing the palestinians is bs, they are on the fasted growing demographics on the planet, eventually they will overtake the jews.

          11. What a load of baby boomer bullshit, next you are gonna defend the 10 million a day they receive from US as rich country welfare.

          12. Okay it seems everyone on the internet I talk to, I bring statements and they start with a personal insult. I will chose to ignore these insults and stick to the arguments and counterarguments.
            Yes, they are censoring dissidents and lobbying for censorship, which sucks. I do not know about historic revisionism,possibly too which also sucks.

            I am not defending google facebook and twitter, I hate what they are doing, even if it is the natural reaction to bringing their product to the masses and trying to appease everyone.

            What do they censor though? comments derivative towards other races, trying to make everyone feel good, bring their profits up etc.

            What do the communists censor? have you heard of the great firewall of china?
            What I am saying is that I prefer the lesser of the two Weavels.
            What can you do about these megacorporations that are so powerful they can start revolutions though? They are not the cause in themselves, they are only the channels thru which humanity is redefining its colective conciousness, like a teenager that is suddenly aware that is dirty and girls won’t look at him and is overwashing till blood comes out (hence social engineering). Hopefully it will pass in a few decades.

          13. Coudn’t care less about Chicom censorship, i just get mad because they are just a convenient scapegoat to deflect from our problems.

          14. Like I said, these problems are side effects of our many perks. Fast communications, fast travel, good economy made possible by the global interconnectivity. We are still trying to cope with it all. We might or might not, we will see in the close future.

          15. You sound like a neoliberal, bragging about “economy”, “GDP”, while ignoring the human misery that goes along with it. Or a neocon that thinks a million deaths is worthy so you can stage elections in a foreign country.

          16. You cannot possibly know what I am after just a few comments. The human misery has always been with us and will always be with us. The problem is when you deal with 8 billion people you don’t talk about individuals, you talk statistics. It’s cruel but let’s be realists. There will always be losers in the game of finite resources. Wishing it were different doesn’t make it so.

            Where in my comments did I give the impression that I agree with staging elections in a foreign country lol? If you’re trying to figure me out , you haven’t yet.

        2. What does google and facebook want from me when they spy? to make money. What do the chinese want? ultimately to make us all their ideological slaves.

          Google, Facebook, and Twitter want the same thing, and Google’s actually helping the Chinese.

    2. LordxMugen
      21 days ago
      If you didnt want me to buy your games you should have said something earlier Obsidian!!
      Steam Stockholm Syndrome

  4. He’s right about one thing: never use the same password twice. The moment hackers get login information, they’ll use a script to instantly hit every known website at once. It’s very common & very obvious to developers when this happens, with one person suddenly hitting thousands of accounts with single login attempts.

    1. Yes, but they still keep doing it. Like those in a store loyalty program complaining their points were stolen.

    1. Games are a Bi-product of what epic does. They don’t care about the games, they care about the money/profits. If you look deeply into Fortnite vs Paragon and how they abandoned Paragon once fortnite gained traction, you’ll see what I’m talking about. It should be of no consequence to them to just keep Paragon going or leave it so people can play it. But nope, scrapped to make way for their money printing press a.k.a Fortnite.

      They struck gold with Fortnite and because of it abandoned Paragon because Fortnite was the bigger honey pot. See, epic doesn’t care about gaming. It’s all about the profits, 100%. Games are just the bi-product of their mission statement. I can guarantee you that if Fortnite made 2 billion like they have claimed and they come out with a new game that mades 2.1 billion, they’d abandon Fortnite in a heart beat. Epic has no loyalty.

    2. It is indeed but they also dgaf about anything besides money. The crowd to which they are trying to appeal – 12 year olds and younger – doesn’t care about 20 year old games that were amazing.

    3. That’s debatable depending on what you are classifying as alternative. I mean you’re talking about crap like Duran Duran, Devo and Hall and Oates versus Alice in Chains, Nirvana (who I don’t care for), Pearl Jam, REM, still a tiny bit of Metallica or Megadeth, Pantera , etc. Not that any metal was ever given any attention by the industry, but, it was.

      Maybe I don’t understand because I never listened to bad music in the 90s. What are we talking here? Ace of Bass? lol

      1. 90s still has some good music,its 2000s that start Sh*tty music with gayboyband…

  5. Poor guy. No matter what he says now no one (sane) will believe him – whether it makes sense or not, is plausible or not.

    In a way it’s a pitty. They were in the perfect position to become relevant, considering recent and ongoing Steam’s gigantic lies and hypocrisy.

  6. Nobody believes him. Epic belong to the Chinse Dictatorship. Even Apple caves to China. In 2020 this will be WeGame Store.

  7. Epic Games Store has already lost the Store war with Steam no matter what they do in the future. They can buy as many timed exclusive games but they cannot buy the loyalty of hundreds of millions of PC gamers who recognize that Valve/Steam has always had their backs especially when PC gaming was not doing so hot in the eyes of all the AAA developers/publishers and instead of finding a solution to PC Gaming’s transitional issues these developers/publishers especially Epic Games decided to abandon ship and kiss the boots of console manufacturers. Valve was the only one who never gave up on us and for that we will always be loyal to Valve/Steam.

    1. There is no platform loyalty, vast majority of people are going to download whatever client they need to play the game they want.

      1. Sounds about right. At the end of the day, it’s the games people are after, doesn’t matter how many features your store have.

        1. Windows Store is like Steam… both take 30% money from developers. Only Epic is developer friendly because they are game developers

      2. This is power of open market on PC – you can download new launcher for free. On consoles you need buy multiple consoles to play exclusive games.

    2. It’s pretty clear this guy has never nor will he ever give a sheeet about PC gamers!

      He just got lucky with Fortnite and now he is basically poisoning our platform of choice because he realized PC grew a whole lot since he last gave us the middle finger.

        1. He did not make billions, he basically stumbled upon them thanks to PUBG. Fortnite was pretty much D.O.A until PUBG became PC greatest hit through all of 2017.

          And you know in order to keep those billions and multiply them you are supposed to cater to your consumers right? He’s just throwing money at exclusives, while earning enormous amounts of hate.

          So he’s burning those billions pretty damn fast, while alienating his consumers, the ones that he should suck up to, if he wants to keep those billions.

          What happens when the next Fortnite comes along, Apex Legends already has had a huge impact on Fortnite, what happens when the next game fad comes. When them moneys stop pouring in.

          All your left with is a bunch of exclusives that will hit Steam eventually and the much earned hate of the PC gaming community.

          I appreciate what Epic is doing, I just think they are going about it the wrong way. And Steam is not even breaking a sweat. Wonder how many players purchase games at release vs at steam sales for 50-80 per cent off. Steam will still make money.

          Now if they really get the Red Dead 2 exclusivity for life deal. He will make enormous amounts of money.

          You get a Rockstar game and people will wait in line to buy that sheeet. Even if pc gamers are treated as an after thought.

          And even then, unless Red Dead online is the greatest thing ever (which is not), people will just beat the game and go back to Steam.

      1. BING”Freakin”O ? Alot of people don’t understand this. That before Fortnite Epic was struggling to regain momentum. Because when this current generation of games first started, most companies were building and using their own engine and stopped using Unreal. Unlike last generation where atleast 8 out of 10 games were made using the Unreal Engine. Then they started to scramble & panic. They struck gold with Fortnite and because of it abandoned Paragon because Fortnite was the bigger honey pot. See, epic doesn’t care about gaming. It’s all about the profits, 100%. Games are just the bi-product of their mission statement. I can guarantee you that if Fortnite made 2 billion like they have claimed and they come out with a new game that mades 2.1 billion, they’d abandon Fortnite in a heart beat. Epic has no loyalty.

        1. What none profit making company do you work for? Why would Epic waste money on Paragon when it was obvious to all that it wasn’t going to be a hit? No companies going to remain loyal to a product that’s losing or not making money, that’s common sense.

    3. I will always support Epic because they are developers friendly. If you want better games and stronger PC market you should support Epic. More money for developers is so much better than more money for Valve

      Epic – 12% for store and unreal engine 4 bundle
      Steam – 30% for store and old source engine

      IIf you want strong PC market then you should help game developers fight with 30% tax from Steam.

      1. That type of behaviour is what turned the gaming industry into a toxic hole. It stopped being about the gamers and started being about the publishers/developers making as much money as possible while exploiting the gamers.

        Anyone who supports Epic will find I won’t buy any of their titles, is at times like this they deserve to get their games pirated and 0 cash.

      2. If your ridiculous comments, AMD Navi, about Epic Games Store are evidence of what owning AMD products does to a person’s brain then I’m absolutely sticking with Intel and Nvidia.

    4. “Epic Games Store has already lost the Store war with Steam”

      …and CPY, CODEX, etc! ?

      Every time I see Tencent Sweeney open his mouth it reminds me to go check if any more Epic Games Store wares have been cracked.

      #epicfail

    5. Valve/Steam has always had their backs

      This is oddly emotional. (And there’s a lot of it going around.) Steam does not “have your back”; they’re a business, and they want to make money.

      Steam owns your games; you don’t. If they decide that you’ve violated their rules and lock you out of your account, then you’re out of luck. If they go out of business, then what guarantee do you have that you’ll still have access to your library? And in my experience, Steam’s customer support has been awful (especially in comparison to GOG’s).

      You’re engaged in a false dichotomy: If you want to punish them for past behavior, then that’s fine, but you don’t have to worship Valve to curse Epic.

      1. Steam owns your games; you don’t

        not just valve all digital store (psn xbox app store google play etc) that’s why gamers still support disc and cartridge because once you buy it you own it. but if the product digital you don’t and everybody knows that.

    6. Yet that’s why Valve does not make games anymore… I remember PC gaming before clients. And it was amazing. Valve have our backs? lol So why did it take a game like Bak before they gave out refunds… Heck Origin had refunds before Steam did 😀 And sure Epic is pretty shady as well. But at least they still make games for PC. 😀

      If anything the only good store that is a client is GoG. 😀

      1. Take off the nostalgia filters and come back to reality. I remember those days too.

        And Epic still makes games? Can you tell me, which games they themselves currently have in development?

    7. You’re this beholden cause they sold you a game. I’d hate to see you’d act if they gave you some a*s.

      1. If you can just rationalise that by being white, Tim is somehow a Nazi or connected to Nazi’s, then violence towards him is ok and everyone one the left will be fine with it 😀

      1. Thanks for not knowing the difference between Steam, a program, and stream, a noun and verb, which has anything to do with Steam except that you can use Steam to stream.

  8. All i read was exclusivity will continue, and all i can say is that Epic will not see a penny from me. I’m a patient man i will wait for the Codex/ CPY make the games available in their “store”, after all “competition” is good right ?

  9. Just stop.

    For a fact people are getting their accounts compromised. Mine was and it’s not the same login I use anywhere else so no, it wasn’t just luck. I’ve literally never used it until 2019. I made it in 2014 to try Unreal Tournament – lol good joke that was – and forgot my password so even I don’t know what it was. The next time I tried to log in to it after finally getting a new password, I couldn’t find games in the store, and then I figured out it was set to China as the region.

    Which is funny considering Epic, owned by a Chinese company, can’t sell games in China.

  10. A reminder that Tencent Holdings also own a 5% stake in both Ubisoft (see shared exclusivity deal between Uplay and EGS for The Division 2) and Activision-Blizzard.

  11. John always posts “clickbait” articles, which attracts attention. He wants clicks….And after seeing so many articles being posted on EPIC games store, further proves my point.

    DSOG is slowly becoming a joke….

    1. As long as he does his “job” right i’ll be happy to support him with at least my “clicks”, what i don’t want from him is to get flooded with retrded mods and pointless articles, and i’d love him to overhaul his “Performance Analisys” in both structure and hardware used (get rid of that fkn 4930 for the love of god).

      1. Tencent Sweeney will never equal Gaben.

        Besides, Gaben isn’t obese. He’s pregnant with Half-Life 3.

        1. damn i was going to say the second picture you posted looks completely rytarded but then i read the text on tim’s shirt in the first picture and now i’m not sure which one looks more rytarded.

  12. They are quite a few paid ‘EPIC game storefront’ SHILLS under this comment section, blindly defending EPIC’s move..lol..:D

  13. Sure. Epic is affiliated with a country known for their aggressive spying. Even if it isn’t for “the Chinese Government” the companies involved are still doing it and obtaining information without consent – like spyware!

    I dont get it. 10 years ago, people were vehemently against forced data collection (aka spyware), and today people hand it over like they are going to get something from it. Bunch of weirdos.

  14. So lets see if we got it

    Trash store ui
    Sends information to china
    Store is perfect says Tim, doesnt need any improvements
    Has been hacked, your personal information is out there
    No old games, no indie games just stealing the latest AAA and makign them times exlusives

    Seems to me you are safer pirating those games and getting a virus from shady sites than using this store.

  15. This is the guy who said that MS was trying to cripple steam and make it unusable, with that in mind I find it hard to take anything he says seriously.

    Anyway yes there have been numerous people reporting numerous breaches on their accounts multiple times so of course security is a huge issue.

  16. i hope EPS will go localize / regional store soon. someone need to give gabe a good kick from his slumber.

  17. Didn’t and won’t read what the an*s of a baboon had to say. Credibility is earned and easily lost. He has no credibility anymore.

  18. It’s clear from Bill’s idiotic a*s questions that the Steam fanboys are running out of reasons to hate on Epic. Why in the world would the Chinese government won’t access to Joe Bob in Cousin F*k Louisiana’s Epic Store account, lol? This line of thinking is beyond reta*ded.

    1. Hypothetically, I would say probably for the same reason the U.S. government would be interested in it. Because there would be far more prominent individuals other than the likes of Joe Bob and his wife/cousin. This is a case of recognizing that in this day and age, there are few commodities worth more than large amounts of data on a population. What specific reasons from one entity to another is irrelevant as they are numerous and it doesn’t change the value of the commodity.

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